Founded On Purpose

Kt McBratney: [00:00:00] Welcome to Founded on Purpose, the show where we get to know the people working to align business and impact, profit, and purpose. I'm your host, Kt McBratney. Each episode, we ask a different person building a fascinating company the same set of questions. They're founders, they're funders, they're movement makers.

And while the questions are the same, the conversations they open up are so beautifully purposeful. And our guest today is Marianna Sachse, founder and CEO of Jackalo, America's first circular children's clothing brand. She's a mother, a maker, and a lifelong environmentalist with background in social work and public health.

I like to think of it as when other people saw another ripped knee in their children's clothes, she saw the opportunity to make something better for people and the planet. Marianna, welcome to the show.

Marianna Sachse: Thank you so much. It's so good to be with you, Kt.

Kt McBratney: Well, we're going to have a fun conversation, and I've been waiting all week.

I know we had to reschedule a couple times, [00:01:00] you know, because of hurricanes and life and the like. So we'll start at the start, and I'd love to know, for question one, we start off in the same place with everyone, in one word, what's your purpose?

Marianna Sachse: My purpose is, one word, I, it, it has to be better. Like it's just better.

You know, how can we do things better for families? How can we do things better for the planet? How can we take a system that has a lot of flaws and make it better for everyone?

Kt McBratney: And what does better mean for you, like, in regards to your journey to found this company? Because, like I said, you've, I know that you're a lifelong environmentalist and making is kind of in your, is in your DNA.

Marianna Sachse: It's in my DNA. For sure.

Kt McBratney: So how is this idea of better kind of been a driving purpose or something that's been a Before you founded Jackalo and through. [00:02:00]

Marianna Sachse: Yeah, I mean, so I grew up in a family that, you know, my, my mother was a maker, her mother was a maker, but they were also just like big believers in leaving the world a better place.

That, you know, your impact was something that was important and kind of, you know, it's part of the legacy that you leave as an individual. Um, and that, you know, we all have a duty, whether it's in our jobs or in, like, the work we do outside of our jobs, of leaving the world a better place. Um, and so that's something that I was always raised with, and I really felt like the way that I was going to do that in my life was through public health and social work, that I've always been someone that's been interested in, like, the impact of Health, community, well being on our lives, um, collectively, you know, and [00:03:00] so I thought that was going to really be where I would focus my energy.

Um, and as I dove into that work, which I loved and I still love, one of the things I could really see was the impact of a really good job, um, and that that's outside of any health or what, like, well being, like, obvious intervention. And I really wanted to find a way that I could combine my love of making with creating good jobs.

Uh, and that's kind of where Jackalo came about. That I could see problems in the clothes that I was receiving for my kids as hand me downs, buying for my kids. And that there were, there were design problems in them and we could make them better and that there was a system that was making it harder for us as parents to get things that were designed in a way that was leaving the world a better [00:04:00] place rather than just taking from it.

Kt McBratney: Something that's clear in that is this idea that better can touch multiple areas. It's not just better product. Better materials, better sourcing. It's like, you looked at very holistically at better. Um, and there's a great graph on your website that I will link to in the show notes that shows what circular means specifically to Jackalo, right?

And I think I've, I've talked about this in a couple other episodes, but as we talk about sustainability and impact companies specifically when it comes to like physical goods and not just software, these words like sustainable, ethically circular. It's awesome that these are entering the zeitgeist and people are hearing them.

And also, I think there's, they can be somewhat relative.

Marianna Sachse: Yes.

Kt McBratney: So, what does circular mean to you? And I want to kind of lay this context because we'll be digging into the business side of it a bit, a bit more later, but tell us what circular means broadly and [00:05:00] how that's interpreted for Jackalo.

Marianna Sachse: Yeah. So, when we think of a traditional consumption model or product development model, there, it's a linear model.

You create something, you use it, and then you throw it away. Okay. That's what we're used to in society. And so a circular model is one where you create something, you use it, and then it comes back into the making cycle. So whether it's through resale, remaking, you know, or, um, upcycling into like, you know, a, a less high quality item.

And cause that's when we think of upcycling that it's not necessarily like, That same level. So maybe you're, you know, taking an item that's worn out and making it into like a coin purse or something like that, you're making it into something small. Um, this way of make, use, remake is the circular model that we [00:06:00] are focused on.

And at Jackalo, we touch on it in a lot of ways. And a lot of the clothes that exist today are not designed for circularity. So you can't just say. We're gonna, you know, buy it back. Um, that's, that's a part of it, but that's not all of it. And so we're trying to think about how we can look at every step of the process with a focus on keeping, you know, items in use for longer, using materials that, uh, are not gonna live on our planet forever, uh, in the long run.

Um, or, you know, for hundreds of years, like most poly, yeah, polyester fabrics will be. Um, so yeah, that's how we think about circularity.

Kt McBratney: Thank you. Thanks for that, like, context that, um, because I think a lot of people think of sustainability when it comes to clothing, and it is like, is it disposable? Is it that cheap, fast fashion that people wear once and throw away, and they think of the textile waste?

But they don't necessarily [00:07:00] think about all the steps before then, or that could be potential other paths outside of it. Right? Like, it's great that there's awareness around textile waste and also like we can start to be more sustainable before it even gets to the consumer. Um, now you, I'm sure could like spout 18 statistics off the top of your head right now about the need for sustainability and circularity in fashion, in clothing, in consumer goods, in children's products.

But with all those challenges and opportunities, I'm curious, what's been your, your most recent win, personally or professionally? And it does not have to be a sustainability win to count.

Marianna Sachse: Yeah. I love that question. Um, I think our most recent win, I mean, this is like a PR win, but I'll take it.

Kt McBratney: A win is a win, my friend.

Marianna Sachse: A win is a win. Yeah. Yeah. So, um, we got [00:08:00] voted the best sustainable children's brand. On, uh, Green Matters blog, which is a, a blog that, you know, they do a lot of like best of lists and they do, um, them through popular vote. So their editors pick the, the finalists and then it's through popular vote that the winner is selected.

And so we got selected as the best sustainable kids brand. And for me, what that really says is that there's a community behind us. That's invested in what we're doing their community of people who are willing to vote for us. We're a smaller brand There are a lot of bigger brands out there that were you know nominated for this and so it's a really nice win for us to like have just the The the love of our community behind us and supporting us And consider, that they consider us one of the best brands.

Kt McBratney: There's this, this, I mean, everyone knows that you say community [00:09:00] and like, say community three times and I appear. But, like, as a former founder and like working with founders day in and day out, like, there are so many hard days. And that validation, even if it's once, even if it's, it's, um, not viewed as one of those big flashy Nasdaq, uh, Tech Crunch headline.

I mean. Successes, those matter a lot, especially when they come from people that you're trying to serve. And I think that there's, I sense with you, and I've always sensed this since we met, that that's whose opinion and whose values mean the most to you is your customers and things like that, instead of thinking them as numbers of a spreadsheet.

Marianna Sachse: Absolutely. I mean, for me, what I always come back to is parenthood is really hard and it's full of compromises. And I feel like there should be some things in parenthood that are easier and you don't have to compromise on. [00:10:00] And so I strive to create a product that is like a no compromise solution. That it's longer lasting, it's more comfortable for your kids, it's better for the planet, ethically made, and you know exactly what to do with it when it's outgrown if you don't have a kid in your household to pass it on to.

But the whole impetus behind all of that is that I just want one little thing in your life as a parent to be easier on a daily basis. And if that's like getting the kids dressed in the morning that you're not having an argument about what they're wearing, if that's like knowing exactly what to do with the clothes when they're outgrown and not being like, you know, is this donation box on the corner actually going to do any good?

Kt McBratney: Mm hmm.

Marianna Sachse: You know, all of those things are. Just like more weight on parents and I want there to be less weight on parents Like I want our lives to you know, there are a million things you have to worry about Let's make this one that you don't have to.

Kt McBratney: Yes, please as a parent. Yes. Okay. I'm [00:11:00] down with that mission Please and thank you.

I Want to dig into the parent side a little bit more in a second But we've set the context of like what sustainability means, what circularity is, and a bit about like what Jackalo is doing at Broad Strokes. And so I highly recommend everybody, uh, curious as to how this model works. Take a look at the website.

It's linked in the notes. There's the trade up program. There's the mending kit you can purchase to learn how to mend things instead of throwing them away or donating them or trading them in. Um, there's lots of resources on the site, but now that we've got this kind of context and framework around.

Where you sit, I'm curious what the single biggest missed opportunity in your field is. Like what's the thing that if you could solve one problem, not just to make things easier for parents, but in the field of clothing, parent products, or products for children, what's the biggest single biggest missed opportunity people just keep walking by?[00:12:00]

Marianna Sachse: Learning. Like 100 percent learning. And so that can be learning from your customers and having conversations with them, learning how they use products, what their needs are, but it's also, and I think this is the most important one, learning from how the products are actually used. So one of the things our trade up program allows us to do is look at the products after they've been worn a ton and have a sense of like, where is this going right?

And where is this going wrong? You know, are there product features that we need to change that we need to improve upon? And without having a buyback program, we can't do that. And most brands don't have buyback programs, and if they do, often those buyback programs are operated completely separately from the brand itself.

So it's completely outsourced to a service provider, and that service provider may not be communicating back learnings about where the products are failing. [00:13:00] And that learning is really important. And I'll give you like a really simple example that we, uh, learned from early on. So, when you look at a lot of clothing items that have a drawstring waist on adult clothes or little kids clothes, they're usually just done with a buttonhole.

Um, and that's fine. For most people, that's absolutely fine. As an adult, we know how to tie our pants. We don't even think about it. But kids often don't know how to tie the waist, like a drawstring waist. And so they will come put on a pair of pants and immediately pull the strings in opposite directions rather than doing that first half of a knot.

And if you know physics, you know that, like, it's, it's, you've got a kind of lever situation going on there and it's, it's really going to put a lot of pressure on that buttonhole, which isn't necessarily the strongest. And so our first iteration of our products [00:14:00] used a buttonhole and I saw that there was a problem there that Kids who don't know how to tie a waistband, pull it in the wrong direction and are gonna rip the waistband.

So we very quickly switch to a grommet, which adds a lot of strength to that tiny little spot, and means that kids don't rip the waistbands of their clothes. Uh, there's still tons of bands out there that do draw stringing waist and don't use a grommet.

Kt McBratney: Oh, I know I was fishing a drawstring out of a, trying to fish a drawstring out of a buttonhole the other day.

It's like the most, it's the most frustrating experience. You're like, I almost got it. I almost got it. I was thinking, I was like, I feel like we, we, we put machines on Mars. We have AI. Why am I fishing this out of these sweatpants in 2024?

Well, I think that's the thing. It's like, we think pants are just pants.

We think we're like, they're just pants. How can they get [00:15:00] innovative? There's lots of little ways that make a big difference. Like I know one of the differences in. In your clothes, you've got this cool, you've got this cool quiz on the site. You can prioritize or filter or shop around like sensitivity, right?

Sensitivity to fabrics or textures and things. So I think it's like this idea of learning seems to be woven through not just your product development, but also the customer experience of being able to do like the trade up program, being able to use the guarantee you have on the products about ripping, like.

There's this cycle of learning, it sounds like, that is also circular.

Marianna Sachse: Yeah, absolutely. I mean, look, you know, we're all growing and learning all the time, and so I see it on the brand side and on the consumer side that, you know, there are a lot of behaviors that we've learned from fast fashion and the ease of it that we need to unlearn.

You know, they're behaviors we've learned from the ease [00:16:00] of certain technology, even simple things like we all love our dryers in the United States, love a dryer. And I spent four years living in the Netherlands, like people don't use dryers all the time in Europe. You know, they don't use dryers all the time in most of the world and clothes last longer there because they don't.

And so kind of unlearning some of these behaviors and saying like, Oh, why are, why are we doing things this way? Is it actually better? Is the convenience actually more convenient? Because if that convenience of drying the clothes and having them ready maybe four hours before, we all know that even if they're ready four hours earlier, they're probably gonna sit in a laundry basket for a week before they get folded in away.

Kt McBratney: We keep it real. Yeah, so it does that real, let's keep real. That's very true.

Marianna Sachse: Doesn't really matter if it's done in the dry or faster. If that means [00:17:00] that the clothes are going to wear out faster and you're going to have to replace your child's entire wardrobe before it's outgrown. And so, you know, we have a lot of relearning to do to make our kids clothes and our own clothes last longer.

There, there's an issue of kind of like the immediate convenience over the long term value, convenience impact that I think

Kt McBratney: all of us can look at it in different ways in our lives, like, and, and kind of re examine and, and toss, turn those over in our heads and consider like just even the small behaviors that we make, like even just interrogating the why, like, Oh yeah, I'll have this dry in two hours, and then it's going to sit in the laundry basket for three days.

Not speaking about anybody in my household. Myself, but like, is, is a really interesting framing and with this idea of relearning top of mind, tell us one of the last times you were wrong [00:18:00] and that was a relearning opportunity for you.

Marianna Sachse: I have so many times that I'm wrong, that's part of, you know, building and growing a business, like learning where your assumption about what a consumer wants or even like, you know, is your, is your customer base representative the ones, the ones that are going to be replying to say a survey, they may not be actually representative of the ones who are actually buying.

Um, and so. I think the most recent area where I was wrong was in just a color choice. Like, I mean, like that's like a very simple, a simple one where we had access to this really, it's a really beautiful fabric and it may be just that This isn't showing up well online, you know, little things like that.

Like is, does it not show up well online? But we had access to some dead stock, [00:19:00] um, organic chambray and this kind of really beautiful orange color. That's like not too orange, not, not too peachy, um, but really beautiful. And we had some of like a style that's well known and loved of our pants made up of it and some shorts made up in it.

And they honestly just like haven't sold. You know, sometimes like the choice is like, okay, I'm, I, you know, I took a risk on a color. I took a risk on a fabric that I thought would be something that people would love. And it's just like, you know, I think there, there's only so much, uh, swaying customers away from blue, green, and pink, which are like the top selling colors of all times, like across the board that you can do.

And people will say, I want colors other than blue, green, and pink, but they don't necessarily buy those colors. And so it's always learn, it's always learning.

Kt McBratney: That's such a good point. And I think that especially for early stage founders that are just, [00:20:00] they're at an earlier place, hence earlier stage, very, very insightful, Kt, um, but with their earlier on this learning and relearning journey and being thoughtful and intentional about what people are saying that they want and what they're actually doing that shows what they want.

And, you know, there's that old, I don't even know if this is truly from Henry Ford, I believe it, but this idea of, like, if you, if I'd have asked the people what they wanted, they would have said a faster car. When it was, or a faster horse. Wow. Yeah, yeah. He said, I would have, they would have told me they wanted a faster horse, not a car because they didn't know they wanted a car.

Yeah. The reality is like, we only know that we wanted cars because we started buying and driving them. Like, he could have said that and been completely wrong. And so sometimes people, you can have, you can ask the right questions, you can design your survey, you can give opportunity for them to be really constructively critical, but the data is also so much [00:21:00] more in what they actually do.

So how do you adjust, right? Knowing that like when you make a color choice, you have a physical product, there are different Right. Yeah. Um, COGS involved with having a physical product, um, a direct to consumer product, what do you do when you, you find out a color you anticipated would sell isn't, isn't popping as much as you thought?

Marianna Sachse: Well, there are a lot of things that you can do. I mean, I think the first one is, um, get more photography. Like, the more that you have images of people in the product, better photos, different photos, different people in them. The more that people can envision themselves in the product. So that's kind of the first one is just like making sure that we're representing it beautifully, making sure that we are putting out the photography that is beautiful that we have and featuring that product in more places, whether it's in our email, in our [00:22:00] social media, you know, it's just driving a little bit more attention to it.

Um, it could be, you know, adjusting the placement of the product on the webpage, you know, so that if we're looking at a collections page, maybe it's the first one you see and not the last one. Um, all of those things can have an impact. Um, the other thing is, like, okay, so I said maybe it, it's better for an in person event, you know, that we, that it, it looks better in person, or you see it, you get it more in person.

And so that may be that we need to, like, okay, what are, what are the spring related in person events we can do where we're bringing that forward? What, where we have an advantage is, Um, we keep our warehousing in house still, we haven't moved to a 3PL and, um, like that's very strategic for us. I mean, number one, it's, it's a cost savings, but number [00:23:00] two, you know, we see more and more brands as they grow actually bringing, you know, they start with, they go to 3PL because that's what they're told they need to do.

And then they bring it back in house eventually because there's just a lot more flexibility with it and then you're not paying. For warehousing fees. And so when you're paying for warehousing fees, then that puts you on this like discount discount discount train, which I want to stay off of as much as possible.

I don't want to be discounting a product just because it's not moving as quickly as I thought it would. Um, and so we can then, you know, rejigger our strategy for that product. in a way that doesn't devalue the product itself, the work that went into it, you know, the construction, all of it is beautiful.

It's a great product. It's. It, it's just giving us more time to say, all right, how can we problem solve this? Because that's what we need to do. We need to problem solve, you know, a product not selling. [00:24:00] Um, and if we can avoid being in a situation where outside forces mean we have to discount it, I want to do that.

Kt McBratney: That's such a good example of how one choice, even if wrong, right, even if the learning is that it wasn't the correct choice or it didn't work out as intended, just lean to a series of other potential choices. It still doesn't. Mean you have to do one thing. You can still retain that agency and use it strategically to adjust and relearn instead of just like, Oh, we were wrong.

Everything is a failure. Everything's wrong. Like we can't fix this. Like most things can be rebounded from, and that's maybe what these wrong moments are, are really just relearning. I love that framing.

Marianna Sachse: Yeah.

Kt McBratney: Thinking about relearning, learning, children, we've talked about kids, I want to talk about play with you because, um, [00:25:00] you are a maker, you're a parent, you obviously have your background in public health, you know how important it is to get out of the office, get out away from screens, but you're also an entrepreneur of a growing, scaling business.

So how do you play and what does play look like for you in this season of your life and your journey?

Marianna Sachse: I love this question. This is such a good question because I think that so often for adults, we don't think about play. And because I work with kids, because I'm focused on kids, like, I know that play is how they process, how they learn, how they test, all of those things are incredibly important.

And so for me, I always look at Play outside is the first thing, because I know that for me being outside, and I think for everybody, [00:26:00] being outside is really grounding. You know, the entrepreneurship journey has lots of ups and downs. It can be really difficult. And so you need more things that are grounding and centering.

And so, whether that's walking more outside with or without my dogs, Going for a run, going for a hike with the family, like those are things that I really like to do to, you know, that's, that's play for me. That's fun. Um, and then I, um, I am a music novice and I love music. I listen a lot to music, but also I, like, I sing and I'm teaching myself.

The baritone ukulele, um, but all of that is like, that's part of how I play, too, that like, I'm learning how to do new things that I get joy out of, um, and then, of course, there's the play of being [00:27:00] with my kids and playing with my kids, and, you know, my children, who are at very different stages, I've got an eight year old and a 14 year old, so play looks different for each of them.

Um, you know, for my eight year old, there's a lot of being in imagination. And so he'll, you know, ask me to tell him a goodnight story. And that is play. Like, that is super creative, just sitting there being like, Okay, you know, how are we gonna create something new? And I try to always have it be About where we live and highlighting little new things about where we live that he may not be thinking of.

Um, so just kind of making our community like the main character in something that is also very fantastic. So just like very goofy, silly, like, you know, dogs are personified, but they're living in our [00:28:00] actual neighborhood. Um, so that's very playful. Um, and then with my older son, he's a He's a soccer head, and so it's going to his soccer games, every once in a while going to a DC United game with him, doing my best to learn more about something that is not my personal interest, but is something that he really, really, extremely loves, so that I can be there with him in his love.

Kt McBratney: Those themes of imagination and Shared or learning about someone else and his interests are both such under talked about skills for an entrepreneur or for anybody that wants to make like net good change in the world. Right. And it's so cool to hear that you're flexing those, not just in your business, but specifically in different ways with each of your children, this idea that you can be a learner about something that you wouldn't [00:29:00] naturally gravitate to.

And also. You can imagine without having to put like a financial model to it, must feel good.

Marianna Sachse: Oh yeah, I, I, I love any of, anything that we're doing where we're just spitballing and playing but not thinking about like the serious side of things and so, yeah. Kids force you to do that in a great way.

Kt McBratney: Alright, we are on question seven already.

Oh my gosh. I know, it's, it's so funny people are like, eight questions, is it gonna go long? And I'm like, no, time goes so fast. And I always regret not making a six hour podcast that, but again, I don't listen to what people say they want. I listen to what people actually do and it's not listen to me talk for six hours.

You can ask my family about that. Um, question seven is one I think you're uniquely qualified to answer and everyone is, of course. I'll just say that on record. But given your background [00:30:00] and your just, like, life and work philosophy, I've been looking forward to hearing your response. How do you know what advice to take and what to leave behind?

How do you navigate that process in an industry where everybody's got opinions, some people have real strong feelings, but ultimately, when it comes to your company, when it comes to your life, when it comes to your family, your choices, you're the decision maker.

Marianna Sachse: I mean, it can be really hard. I mean, because there are so many experts out there.

And everybody does have an opinion. Um, some of it is just trusting your gut. You know, I've definitely had people say, well, the clothing business is one business and the resale business is another business. Like, why combine them? And I listen to that. I get that. They are kind of two separate businesses.

But I ignore that [00:31:00] because neither of them are working independently, and that's what my gut tells me. That clothes need to be designed to work in the second hand phase. Second hand clothing needs to be better and easier for everybody to access. And by combining them, we do both. Um, and that's where a gut sense really comes in.

Like kept me centered and keeps me centered and gives me a response to people when they're giving me advice that I don't want to take. Um, so that's what, you know, a really big piece of it. There's, there also does have to be a willingness to be wrong, a willingness to try new things and to determine if that's the right choice and then move on if it's not.

I'm a big believer in failing and failing fast. [00:32:00] You know, that's part of how you navigate, you know, and I, I cannot believe I'm going to use a sailing analogy.

Kt McBratney: It's okay. People who have listened to the podcast know that I come out with random baseball analogies sometimes. Um, I don't know. I speak in mixed metaphors.

So you are, you are, it's a safe space for sailing. Strange mix in my head. Weird metaphors.

Marianna Sachse: Okay. Exactly. That's great. You know, my dad was a sailor, uh, and not a very good one, but one with tons of passion for it. And, you know, I, I remember spending a lot, a lot of time in the wind. And, you know, you know that in order to move forward, you don't just go straight.

You tack left, you tack right. And it's about testing and ensuring that, you know, the, the overall direction is straight, but you may try different things. And course correct. And like, that's something that will [00:33:00] happen to every entrepreneur, you will receive advice, you will think about this, does this align with my gut?

Sometimes it will align with your gut. Sometimes you'll say, because we all have imposter syndrome at no matter what level we're at. Sometimes we say maybe they are right. And we may try it. And, you know, this is where. It's important to pay attention to where we're going to keep that metaphor going, where the wind is blowing.

Oh my God, I'm rolling my eyes at myself. But anyhow, you know, we can test somebody else's idea. We can test their advice out. We can see if that advice is right for ourselves, for our business. And if it's not, we can change. And like, that's the thing that I, like, love so much in business and in life in general.[00:34:00]

Is that, you know, we can accept some people's advice and then realize that wasn't the right advice to accept and we can fix it. And it's just kind of all about coming back to your true north and to your path and learning because we are not experts in every single thing. And we have to learn, like, what is going to work for us in our business through experimentation.

Kt McBratney: Yes. Love it. Yes, agree. And also, the metaphor worked perfectly. It's a little corny, a little cheesy, a little played out because it's true. But I mean, you're absolutely right. It absolutely, and

Marianna Sachse: sailing metaphors are always, always corny. Look at the names on any boat and you will know that they are always corny.

Kt McBratney: People who own boats, they love a pun. And I love that for them, [00:35:00] and I love that for me, who gets to occasionally see boats and, and chuckles. So thank you to everyone who's named your boat some kind of pun. It's, it's, I know it's absolutely brightened my day. All right, we're at the last question. You do so many things, you wear lots of hats, and also you have a very clear, true North.

What is the most challenging thing about your job, and what is the absolute best part of what you do?

Marianna Sachse: I think the most challenging thing about my job is working against a system that's much larger. Then the one that I've created and the one that I'm in. So if you look at fast motion, I'm very squarely in that slow fashion space.

You know, working against such a big and such a powerful system is incredibly hard. And some of that is [00:36:00] that they have distinct advantages because of scale, because of power, um, because of a willingness to do things in a way that is harmful to people and planet. That, you know, allow their business to have, you know, better margins or whatever, um, and just kind of working against that and being part of the change is a very big challenge that I am definitely out for.

I think the best thing is making families happy and knowing that we are having an impact on, and I'm going to say mothers in particular, but It's all parents, but mothers in particular across the world, even though we're not selling to every single nation in the world, but I think most, you know, most of our producers are women, most of our producers are mothers, [00:37:00] and I like to think that there is a thread that connects all mothers in the world, and all parents, too.

Um, but like, when we look at, like, look in our children's eyes, we see tons of opportunity, we see tons of risk, and we are all worried about those exact same things. And the fact that we can make one person's life a little bit better, whether it's our producer who has, you know, You know, a safe job in a clean environment with opportunities for growth and opportunities for their kids to go to school, or whether it's the parent that I saw in the park in my neighborhood the other day where their kid was wearing a pair of Jackalope pants and he's like, Oh my God, these like last eight times as long as any of our other kids pants, which is a better advertisement that I could possibly write.

But he was thrilled for his kid and, like, [00:38:00] his, like, partner was thrilled for the kid, too, and, like, having found something that, like, makes their lives easier, that's the best thing to me. Like, every little way that we can make someone's life better is, like, just makes me so happy.

Kt McBratney: It all comes full circle, right?

The theme of circle and better, right? This purpose of better. It's, it's, it's a beautiful continuing circle. If, if that's, if that's the impact and the results you're putting out into the world. This has been just so much fun. My wheels are turning about so many things that I will likely have 18 extra tabs open on my browser, uh, to dive into.

So thank you for sharing your insights and perspectives. How can people. Follow you. How can people connect, learn more about Jackalo more, learn more about you and what and how you're building.

Marianna Sachse: Yeah. Um, so they can find us online at hellojackalo.com. Um, [00:39:00] and on all the socials at the same thing, we're most active on Instagram.

Um, if you're interested in following us kind of professionally on the that side, we're absolutely on LinkedIn and you can find me there. Um, and you can find Jackalo there as well. Um. Yeah. Those are the best ways to, to connect with us.

Kt McBratney: Awesome. And for those who have stuck around thus far, I have one final surprise question I'm pulling out.

Yay. What was the inspiration behind the brand name in a, in a nutshell because it's so fun. Where did Jackalo come from?

Marianna Sachse: Yeah. Well, I mean, I think whenever you're starting a business, there's always the question of like, what's the name that I want and what's the, like, what's the thing that I can actually get like domain names to and things like that.

The boring part. Um. But for us, it was really, and, and I say us because my naming partner is always my husband. He's really, really good at this. We sat down and really thought about [00:40:00] like, what's the feeling we want people to come away with. And that feeling is one of youthfulness and play. Um, and so we started digging into play and we were living in the Netherlands and he stumbled on a playground song in the UK.

Called Hi Lo Jack a Lo, just think of like Miss Mary, like that we would have played on the play clapping hand game sort of thing with a silly song and that word Jack a Lo just stood out to us. And so we're like, okay, what does it mean? It has no meaning. Like it literally there's no meaning. It's just like kids singing.

There's no like we couldn't even find a backstory to it. And I was like, I kind of love that. I kind of love a word that comes from children that is all about play, that exudes play even if you have no idea where it comes from. And [00:41:00] it's just a little bit fun to say. And so, that's how we ended up with jackalo.

Kt McBratney: I love it. It's so fun. Our, uh, our partner Paul, um, at RenewVC, he's a design expert. And he often says, A brand is an empty vessel for us to put meaning into. And so the idea that this is this fun word that you were like, this makes us feel a certain way and represent something, and you've used it as a container to hold playfulness and quality and care is so cool.

Thank you for, thank you for indulging on the unplanned question. It's, it's, you know, sometimes I break my own rules because I can.

Marianna Sachse: Yeah, you can. You're, you're in charge here.

Kt McBratney: It's, it's kind of nice. Um, thank you again. So, so much. Everybody check out Jackalo, follow Marianna, follow along the journey and, um, dive into the resources that we've shared because they are a treasure trove.

And take care until the next time. Bye y'all.

Marianna Sachse: Thank you so much. This was so much fun.